A constant and tense battle against regulations
--Compared to other genres, the quality of "Eva" is quite high. Did you have any expectation of that kind of evaluation?
Anno
I didn't have any expectations, but I did have hopes. I've never been able to be proud of my work or my anime works to people who don't watch anime. After "Space Battleship Yamato," it seemed like anime fans were being accepted by the public. My generation was happy about that. But it was an illusion. The illusion of public recognition has led to the current failure.
When we buy anime goods, we should be embarrassed. It should be embarrassing for a person over 20 to buy Sailor Moon anime goods, but they buy them without hesitation. That illusion still exists today. The truth is, it's not just embarrassing, it's ridiculous.
We anime fans are the ones who are the furthest away from the world. That's why I decided to make work that I could be proud of, or at least not embarrassed by, even for people who don't know about anime. I was trying to create something within the animation category that I wouldn't be ashamed to show to the world.
The target age range was 30 plus or minus 10, that is, from 20 to 40 years old. Those over 40 are the generation before Space Battleship Yamato was broadcasted. There is no anime for that generation, so I removed them from the target age range.
--Miyazaki and Oshii went in the direction of abandoning the anime style, so to speak, in order to appeal to people other than anime fans. You, on the other hand, went in the direction of convincing people by using mecha and beautiful girls to a high standard.
Anno
As a result, yes.
--By the way, there are a lot of posts on NIFTY(*1) saying that they don't like the second half of the story, they don't like to see Aska suffer. I have a lot of feelings about that character, too.
Anno
I like her too (laughs).
--She's good. By the way, I felt something strongly in my heart when I saw the reaction of those anime fans. Non-anime fans are rather moved by the necessity of the main character's death. However, the people inside the anime are more frightened or nervous about this development.
Did you take this into consideration?
Anno
I didn't really take that into account. The principle purpose of watching TV is pleasure. In short, we watch TV because it makes us feel good. Having grown up with television as such a medium, I can understand why people close the shutters when they see something unfamiliar. They want to see a cheerful Asuka, not a suffering Asuka. They feel uncomfortable and turn off the TV. Nowadays, people have a narrow view. When I did a little violence in episode 18, I was criticized. I guess they are not used to seeing blood and dead bodies.
--In episode 20, the sex scene between Misato and Kaji was shown for more than 30 seconds with only their voices. Were you planning to break the self-imposed restrictions of TV anime?
Anno
At that time, I was under pressure. There are always restrictions. It was a tense battle. But sex is a basic human right. I don't agree with the idea that it is wrong for anime characters to have sex.
--What do you think about the attachment that anime fans have to the characters?
Anno
Already during the production of "Gundam," the director Yoshiyuki Tomino (*2) made the core point that his work was just giving anime fans a place to parody. I felt the same way with "Sailor Moon". There is no substance in that anime. Just characters and a minimal world. In other words, there are only dolls and a sandbox, and you are free to make sand mounds and characterize the dolls. It's a very user-friendly playground for animation fans. I think it's perfect for people who want to create their own animation but can't make it themselves. There is a lot of room in anime for them to do that. Eva" was good in this respect. Characters are just symbolism, after all.
--I think Mamoru Oshii at one time had the same perception, do you feel sympathy for him?
Anno
No, I don't really feel it in terms of the work. He brings images from Shuji Terayama(*3) and many other places. It's a place that anime fans don't know, so it seems to be original. I think he doesn't have anything in his mind either. Manga with original author (*4) is more interesting.
--I see. Returning to the previous point, there is a paradox that outside the animation industry, works that do not look like animation, such as those of Mamoru Oshii and Katsuhiro Otomo, or works that join the group of Japanese films, such as those of Hayao Miyazaki, are highly valued.
Do you think that "Eva" will be a breakthrough?
Anno
I think we've taken a half step forward, and now Studio Voice has come to interview us (laughs).
*1) An online service service that was operated by NIFTY Corporation from 1987 to 2006.
*2) Japanese animation director, director, screenwriter, manga author, lyricist, and novelist. He was involved in the production of "Mighty Atom," Japan's first half-hour animated television series, and has known the Japanese TV animation industry since its early days. His representative works include the Gundam series such as "Mobile Suit Gundam", "Space Runaway Ideon", "Aura Battler Dunbine", and other works related to Byston Well.
*3) Japanese poet and playwright. He is the leader of the theatrical laboratory "Tenjo Sajiki". He has been called "an alchemist of words" and "one of the four heavenly kings of underground theater," and in addition to the above, he has been active in multiple fields and has published a vast amount of literary works.
*4) Manga with original author is a term for works that have an original author who develops the story and character settings separately from the manga artist who draws the pictures.
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